weird problem where I can't launch the program. I downloaded the latest stable 64-bit build for windows and unzipped it, then ran the exe. But it sort of gives up and idk what to do now. I've tried the 32-bit version in case that for some reason works but it doesn't. I do still have the original Bosca on my computer, would that cause a problem?
Hey there! No, old Bosca doesn’t affect the new version in any way. Are you familiar with the command line/terminal for your operating system? Could you open it from the folder where you unzipped to and run Bosca Ceoil Blue this way? This should show some errors if the problem is with the app.
EDIT: okay so yes this works, but trying to run the program from the .exe unfortunately still doesn't work. It's cumbersome, but I'm honestly just glad it works.
Hmm, there shouldn’t be any difference whatsoever whether you start the .exe from the File Explorer or from a terminal. Can it be that it’s your antivirus/antimalware software blocking it, perhaps? Not sure what else to suggest here, because that’s a pretty unusual circumstance.
If there aren’t any errors when running from the command line, we can only guess about the source of the issue. I guess you can try making a .bat file in the same directory to execute the same command line operation with just a click, so it’s less cumbersome.
Sorry if I can’t be of any more help, but I’m really confused by your findings.
I love this program! A great revival of an already great creation, super happy to see you furthering Terry's work. Do you think this will ever be available on mobile devices in the future? Not a necessity, just curious! Making beats on the go would be super cool.
Yes, I definitely have plans to release on Android :) It’s all just a matter of adapting the UI and input handling for small touch-sensitive screens. The synth itself works perfectly fine on Android already.
For iOS I just don’t have the hardware to develop on. I can kind of just build for macOS blindly, trusting the engine’s support, as it is just another desktop application, but I don’t think this will work well for iOS/iPadOS releases, unfortunately.
Hey, thanks for the offer! The project is open source, so if you’d like to contribute just drop by the repo anytime and see if there is any bug that you’d like to fix:
For features, please open an issue or a discussion first if you have some ideas, so we can arrive to the solution together before committing to anything.
Exporters and importers are just classes coded in GDScript, which create either a string or a binary buffer according to the format specification, and write them to disk. You can find them in the io folder, and the GUI hooks are in the IOManager class.
No, what I meant was how io/WavExporter.gd is connected to the export option and how export is managed. also you can check the proposal for the features on which we are thinking to work after your approval and include them in next release
That’s why I mentioned the IOManager class. That’s where the GUI is connected to the logic behind the export process. That’s where user interactions are handled, and then an exporter class handles the rest.
Hey, can you give me a bit more details? What operating system do you have? And what steps specifically do you attempt to take which don’t work? Would be very helpful if you could record a short clip on it too.
I couldn't get the video to work, but when I open bosca coeil on my computer, which is a good computer, it opens; then, no matter what version I use, it doesn't actually display the place to MAKE the music, and just shows a gray box below. Clicking buttons does nothing!.
No, this is a hard limitation of this app. For the synthesizer that the app uses this handling more tracks in polyphony is not a problem, but this might not be the case for various external formats like MIDI. So for now I don’t have plans to allow for more tracks, 8 seems like a good middle ground for the target audience of Bosca.
Is there any documentation on this software? For example, are there any keyboard shortcuts to do certain actions? I was wondering because it'd be neat to be able to select and copy notes and paste them in a new arrangement piece.
Hey! All documentation is available in the app itself in the “Help” menu, including all the shortcuts available to you. There is, though, no shortcut to copy notes between patterns, because there is no way to select notes in a pattern. Adding such behavior is a bit of a problem, as the click and drag behavior in the pattern editor is already rich with functions for mouse buttons and modifier keys.
When will there be an apk version? I've been waiting for one for a long time... Bosca ceoil is one of my most beloved tools for making music, I love it, thank you very much for reviving it!♡
The Android version requires some rethinking of the UI, so it will take some time. I’m working alone on this, plus I have other projects going on, so my plans for the Android version are for some time next year.
Could there also be a version for Chromebook? because I'm using one and it's very limited... practically an apk but with the same PC controls. Thanks! ;D
I’ll be working on the web version soon, which should be fully compatible with Chromebooks! Unfortunately, I don’t have a way to develop and test a native Chromebook app, so I can’t make any promises about that. But I guess we’ll see if maybe the Android version just works :)
Custom instruments can come in a lot of different shapes and sizes, and Bosca aims to be simple and beginner friendly. So it’s a conscious choice to not have a way for importing new instruments, because that can get complicated very quickly.
Instead, I’d rather we fill in the gaps in the presets that the tool provides, if there are some instrument types that are missing. Do you have any particular suggestions?
Would u ever consider adding the ability to add effects to individual tracks, I would say it's one of the only major issues with the software cos a lot of the time i wanna add delay to my lead but I have to add it to my drums as well and it messes up the sound.
I like the idea of more advanced effect/filter setups. I think that they were added as they are for simplicity, to test it out. There are code comments in the original Bosca that suggest some unresolved issues, which leads me to believe there was a plan to do more with them.
That said, I can’t promise this any time soon. This kind of change would require modifications to the file format, which makes it a breaking change. So I’ll have to revisit it later when I consider the next major release (4.0).
I might be mistaken, but it looks like clicking the notes on the left doesn't play the note as a preview? Would that be able to be implemented in the future? I usually prefer that over placing a note to see how it sounds. Thank you for keep this updated!!
Yeah, I didn’t know about that feature in the original (or perhaps I had forgotten about it). But kind folks at Bosca’s subreddit reminded me about it, and I’ve already implemented it for beta 2 which should be out some time next week!
Thanks for adding this feature. However, there appears to be a bug where the notes will not play if the playback line is at the start of the song. Speaking of which, it would be handy if there was a keyboard shortcut to move the playback line back to the start.
Are there plans for adding undo/redo and simple shortcuts anytime soon? It'd definitely make this worth using for me. Other than that this is a great project!
Yes, I will work on undo/redo soon! But what shortcuts are missing? There are plenty of them, at least for things which don’t need to be mouse-driven :) Or do you mean you want to reassign them? For that I don’t have any specific plans at this time.
That's great :D There aren't many I'm thinking of, mainly ctrl+shift+s for save as A few combos to edit the arrangement, like alt+click to place a section rather than dragging it. Not many off the top of my head though.
This is a great tool with huge potential I guess, tutorial is great. I bet it would make it more awesome as it is now by adding also some known music tutorials (not entire tune but a few seconds, split by instruments/channels, explaining how to do each instrument and how to put them together to create the final song.)
For instance Mercury (J. Murphy, Sunshine), Old souls/Time (H. Zimmer, Inception) or maybe some easier musics. Inspiration could also comes from the 80s games like on Amstrad CPC which brings us great chip tunes.
I'm no musician by far (always hate the few lessons I've got in school :P) but still as pretty much everyone, I like music, even creating some in my head, but I would like to learn also how to give them some life with your tool.
I would be ill-equipped to give anyone music lessons :) Besides, with Bosca you cannot create just about any kind of music. Bosca Ceoil is a step sequencer, your music will have a distinct rhythm to it, which you cannot escape. Orchestral music that you reference, from Sunshine and Inception, is simply impossible here. You’d need a much more powerful DAW to have that level of control over the melody and composition.
Bosca fits a particular niche. When getting to know it, I think it’s better to approach Bosca not from the perspective of “I want to realize some very specific idea from my head” but rather as a box full of classic LEGOs. Akin to a step sequencer, you are working on a grid with LEGOs, yet you can create some impressively complex structures after gaining some experience. You need to learn the limitations and what the tool can achieve, which will shape your ideas for what you can make with it.
It’s not a limitless tool (as if anything is, right?), but it’s also not overwhelming. You have few simple rules which you have to follow, but that can be good for creativity in certain ways. Once you learn what this tool can do, you can be efficient at solving particular problems with it and getting the result in the niche that this tool excels at.
This is awesome! I've played with Beepbox and am using 1BitDragon right now, I love these music editors that work with my smooth brain. Great work giving this software new life!!!
Is there by any chance a plan to add pitch bending or bridging between notes like Beepbox?
I don’t have any specific plans for extending its musical capabilities, but this particular feature has been requested elsewhere. My current concern is how to expose pitch bending without losing the simplicity of the app. Like, there are many things which can be done on the technical level, but can also detract from the experience that Bosca aims to provide, y’know?
I’ll look into how Beepbox does it, maybe that’ll give me some inspirations!
I totally understand, it needs to stay simple or else it will become enough like the DAW's that have such a steep learning curve that it becomes a major barrier for entry. It would lose something that makes it really special.
That being said, Beepbox does it pretty simply, it itself being an app that's intuitive and simple to use. Iirc, you simply hold the button that places a note and drag it to another note to bridge it.
**Edit, I actually just checked it out, you hold alt, then drag the note to bridge.
this got me thinking how cute it would be if godot got its own built in music editor like pico8... i wonder how much work it would be to port the format from this program to work with godot's sound and music functionality
What you need is a synthesizer. Godot has support for generated audio streams, but how it is generated is up to users to implement. This is what Bosca uses. It has a custom software synthesizer and it produces data for the Godot’s audio stream to play back.
You can totally make an editor plugin similar in functionality to Bosca Ceoil. You can probably even adapt the app itself into a plugin relatively easily. The app is just a bunch of fancy UI on top of the synthesizer, but you can make whatever you want with the synthesizer. It’s also open source and free to use :)
This creates a very strong argument for not having a music editor as built-in functionality.
ah yeah, you know, in retrospect that makes a lot of sense, it's probably better if fans and devs can make their own stand alone synths rather than pre-boxing one in with the program itself, in pico8 it works because everything is supposed to be self contained, but not everyone will want to use the bosca synthesizer in their godot project, so it would just be extra bloat to the engine for people who want to make their own
i love what you're doing here! however in linux i start off having a good experience until the music starts to get crunchy and my whole pc slows down to a near hault, and this is with only one pattern and no other programs running, thankyou for devoting time to this project btw:)
Hey again! I’ve got myself a Pop OS install on an old laptop, and after playing around for a bit I couldn’t reproduce any problem like you describe.
Would you mind giving me a bit more details? Namely, what’s your operating system and hardware spec? Were you doing anything specific in the moment it started to get crunchy? Any particular instrument, effect, filter and volume setting? Can you reproduce the issue or was it a one-time thing? Does it happen with different patterns after some time or is there anything that they have in common?
Details like that will give me a better starting point to keep looking, and maybe other users would then be able to confirm. If you have a GitHub account, I’d appreciate this info to be provided as a report there:
https://github.com/YuriSizov/boscaceoil-blue/issues
This helps keeping track of every issue in one place. But also don’t feel like you have to do all this work. I’ll be testing it on Linux more now, and may end up repeating your experience at some point with my tools at the ready.
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weird problem where I can't launch the program. I downloaded the latest stable 64-bit build for windows and unzipped it, then ran the exe. But it sort of gives up and idk what to do now. I've tried the 32-bit version in case that for some reason works but it doesn't. I do still have the original Bosca on my computer, would that cause a problem?
Hey there! No, old Bosca doesn’t affect the new version in any way. Are you familiar with the command line/terminal for your operating system? Could you open it from the folder where you unzipped to and run Bosca Ceoil Blue this way? This should show some errors if the problem is with the app.
I will try and report back with my findings.
EDIT: okay so yes this works, but trying to run the program from the .exe unfortunately still doesn't work. It's cumbersome, but I'm honestly just glad it works.
Hmm, there shouldn’t be any difference whatsoever whether you start the .exe from the File Explorer or from a terminal. Can it be that it’s your antivirus/antimalware software blocking it, perhaps? Not sure what else to suggest here, because that’s a pretty unusual circumstance.
If there aren’t any errors when running from the command line, we can only guess about the source of the issue. I guess you can try making a .bat file in the same directory to execute the same command line operation with just a click, so it’s less cumbersome.
Sorry if I can’t be of any more help, but I’m really confused by your findings.
I love this program! A great revival of an already great creation, super happy to see you furthering Terry's work. Do you think this will ever be available on mobile devices in the future? Not a necessity, just curious! Making beats on the go would be super cool.
Yes, I definitely have plans to release on Android :) It’s all just a matter of adapting the UI and input handling for small touch-sensitive screens. The synth itself works perfectly fine on Android already.
For iOS I just don’t have the hardware to develop on. I can kind of just build for macOS blindly, trusting the engine’s support, as it is just another desktop application, but I don’t think this will work well for iOS/iPadOS releases, unfortunately.
Nonetheless, that's super cool to hear! I wish you the best of luck dude
I apologize for any inconvenience caused by the repeated messages.
Your patience and understanding are greatly appreciated.
Dear yurisizov,
I’m Ray. We’re impressed by Boscaceoil-blue and would love to help develop it further.
We offer our skills to add features and fix bugs. Let’s discuss how we can support your vision.
Best regards,
Ray
Hey, thanks for the offer! The project is open source, so if you’d like to contribute just drop by the repo anytime and see if there is any bug that you’d like to fix:
https://github.com/YuriSizov/boscaceoil-blue
For features, please open an issue or a discussion first if you have some ideas, so we can arrive to the solution together before committing to anything.
Can you how exporter and exporter option are programmed and connected to each other for us to be able to add bug fixes and new features
Exporters and importers are just classes coded in GDScript, which create either a string or a binary buffer according to the format specification, and write them to disk. You can find them in the
iofolder, and the GUI hooks are in theIOManagerclass.No, what I meant was how
io/WavExporter.gdis connected to the export option and how export is managed.also you can check the proposal for the features on which we are thinking to work after your approval and include them in next release
That’s why I mentioned the
IOManagerclass. That’s where the GUI is connected to the logic behind the export process. That’s where user interactions are handled, and then an exporter class handles the rest.It wont let me use any of the buttons? Is this an issue for anyone else, or is it my computer?
Hey, can you give me a bit more details? What operating system do you have? And what steps specifically do you attempt to take which don’t work? Would be very helpful if you could record a short clip on it too.
I couldn't get the video to work, but when I open bosca coeil on my computer, which is a good computer, it opens; then, no matter what version I use, it doesn't actually display the place to MAKE the music, and just shows a gray box below. Clicking buttons does nothing!.
Are you familiar with the command line/terminal on your system? Could you try running Bosca from it and let me know what the output is?
thank you for making bosca ceoil, i learned in this program, and its so simple, so easy to learn yet so effective, thank you
Is there any way to have more than 8 tracks at a time?
No, this is a hard limitation of this app. For the synthesizer that the app uses this handling more tracks in polyphony is not a problem, but this might not be the case for various external formats like MIDI. So for now I don’t have plans to allow for more tracks, 8 seems like a good middle ground for the target audience of Bosca.
You can, however, download audacity (another free audio software) and layer exported wavs from bosca ceoil to achieve the same end.
oh cool! Maybe I'll try that out
Is there any documentation on this software? For example, are there any keyboard shortcuts to do certain actions? I was wondering because it'd be neat to be able to select and copy notes and paste them in a new arrangement piece.
Hey! All documentation is available in the app itself in the “Help” menu, including all the shortcuts available to you. There is, though, no shortcut to copy notes between patterns, because there is no way to select notes in a pattern. Adding such behavior is a bit of a problem, as the click and drag behavior in the pattern editor is already rich with functions for mouse buttons and modifier keys.
When will there be an apk version? I've been waiting for one for a long time... Bosca ceoil is one of my most beloved tools for making music, I love it, thank you very much for reviving it!♡
Hey there! Thank you for your support :)
The Android version requires some rethinking of the UI, so it will take some time. I’m working alone on this, plus I have other projects going on, so my plans for the Android version are for some time next year.
Omggg ok! amazing!
Could there also be a version for Chromebook? because I'm using one and it's very limited... practically an apk but with the same PC controls. Thanks! ;D
I’ll be working on the web version soon, which should be fully compatible with Chromebooks! Unfortunately, I don’t have a way to develop and test a native Chromebook app, so I can’t make any promises about that. But I guess we’ll see if maybe the Android version just works :)
Oooooh ok thanks a lot! I trust you and good luck! (>‿◠)✌.
Is there any way to add custom instruments without digging through the Sauce Code?
And if not, I, Bucket sir Bucketon the 3rd hereby request this as an included feature in this exquisite musical production software.
-Bucket
Custom instruments can come in a lot of different shapes and sizes, and Bosca aims to be simple and beginner friendly. So it’s a conscious choice to not have a way for importing new instruments, because that can get complicated very quickly.
Instead, I’d rather we fill in the gaps in the presets that the tool provides, if there are some instrument types that are missing. Do you have any particular suggestions?
Probably 1 customizable synth instrument that more advanced users could use to make their own sounds.
-Bucket
If there's eventually an android version that's similar to Caustic, then I'm sold.
Feature-wise, a release on any platform will be the same! So I wouldn’t expect a pocket DAW like Caustic out of Bosca :)
That's cool. I'm just looking for something affordable to play with, so I'll take what I can get.
Would u ever consider adding the ability to add effects to individual tracks, I would say it's one of the only major issues with the software cos a lot of the time i wanna add delay to my lead but I have to add it to my drums as well and it messes up the sound.
I like the idea of more advanced effect/filter setups. I think that they were added as they are for simplicity, to test it out. There are code comments in the original Bosca that suggest some unresolved issues, which leads me to believe there was a plan to do more with them.
That said, I can’t promise this any time soon. This kind of change would require modifications to the file format, which makes it a breaking change. So I’ll have to revisit it later when I consider the next major release (4.0).
a godsend for linux users!!! finally i don't need a 1gb wine folder
AND it uses godot for the port, amazing!!! the DEFINITIVE bosca ceoil experience
this is revolutionary!!
I might be mistaken, but it looks like clicking the notes on the left doesn't play the note as a preview? Would that be able to be implemented in the future? I usually prefer that over placing a note to see how it sounds. Thank you for keep this updated!!
Yeah, I didn’t know about that feature in the original (or perhaps I had forgotten about it). But kind folks at Bosca’s subreddit reminded me about it, and I’ve already implemented it for beta 2 which should be out some time next week!
Thanks for adding this feature. However, there appears to be a bug where the notes will not play if the playback line is at the start of the song. Speaking of which, it would be handy if there was a keyboard shortcut to move the playback line back to the start.
Are there plans for adding undo/redo and simple shortcuts anytime soon? It'd definitely make this worth using for me. Other than that this is a great project!
Yes, I will work on undo/redo soon! But what shortcuts are missing? There are plenty of them, at least for things which don’t need to be mouse-driven :) Or do you mean you want to reassign them? For that I don’t have any specific plans at this time.
That's great :D
There aren't many I'm thinking of, mainly ctrl+shift+s for save as
A few combos to edit the arrangement, like alt+click to place a section rather than dragging it. Not many off the top of my head though.
“Save as” is bound to Ctrl+Alt+S right now. You can find all of the shortcuts in the Help section (make sure to check all tabs in there!) :)
This is a great tool with huge potential I guess, tutorial is great.
I bet it would make it more awesome as it is now by adding also some known music tutorials (not entire tune but a few seconds, split by instruments/channels, explaining how to do each instrument and how to put them together to create the final song.)
For instance Mercury (J. Murphy, Sunshine), Old souls/Time (H. Zimmer, Inception) or maybe some easier musics. Inspiration could also comes from the 80s games like on Amstrad CPC which brings us great chip tunes.
I'm no musician by far (always hate the few lessons I've got in school :P) but still as pretty much everyone, I like music, even creating some in my head, but I would like to learn also how to give them some life with your tool.
Thanks for your work.
Hey there, and thank you!
I would be ill-equipped to give anyone music lessons :) Besides, with Bosca you cannot create just about any kind of music. Bosca Ceoil is a step sequencer, your music will have a distinct rhythm to it, which you cannot escape. Orchestral music that you reference, from Sunshine and Inception, is simply impossible here. You’d need a much more powerful DAW to have that level of control over the melody and composition.
Bosca fits a particular niche. When getting to know it, I think it’s better to approach Bosca not from the perspective of “I want to realize some very specific idea from my head” but rather as a box full of classic LEGOs. Akin to a step sequencer, you are working on a grid with LEGOs, yet you can create some impressively complex structures after gaining some experience. You need to learn the limitations and what the tool can achieve, which will shape your ideas for what you can make with it.
It’s not a limitless tool (as if anything is, right?), but it’s also not overwhelming. You have few simple rules which you have to follow, but that can be good for creativity in certain ways. Once you learn what this tool can do, you can be efficient at solving particular problems with it and getting the result in the niche that this tool excels at.
Cheers!
This is awesome! I've played with Beepbox and am using 1BitDragon right now, I love these music editors that work with my smooth brain. Great work giving this software new life!!!
Is there by any chance a plan to add pitch bending or bridging between notes like Beepbox?
Hey, thanks!
I don’t have any specific plans for extending its musical capabilities, but this particular feature has been requested elsewhere. My current concern is how to expose pitch bending without losing the simplicity of the app. Like, there are many things which can be done on the technical level, but can also detract from the experience that Bosca aims to provide, y’know?
I’ll look into how Beepbox does it, maybe that’ll give me some inspirations!
I totally understand, it needs to stay simple or else it will become enough like the DAW's that have such a steep learning curve that it becomes a major barrier for entry. It would lose something that makes it really special.
That being said, Beepbox does it pretty simply, it itself being an app that's intuitive and simple to use. Iirc, you simply hold the button that places a note and drag it to another note to bridge it.
**Edit, I actually just checked it out, you hold alt, then drag the note to bridge.
Also! It could be done like in FL Studio using Pitch Bend Notes, which work pretty intuitively in my opinion.
this got me thinking how cute it would be if godot got its own built in music editor like pico8... i wonder how much work it would be to port the format from this program to work with godot's sound and music functionality
Don't threaten me with a good time!
What you need is a synthesizer. Godot has support for generated audio streams, but how it is generated is up to users to implement. This is what Bosca uses. It has a custom software synthesizer and it produces data for the Godot’s audio stream to play back.
You can totally make an editor plugin similar in functionality to Bosca Ceoil. You can probably even adapt the app itself into a plugin relatively easily. The app is just a bunch of fancy UI on top of the synthesizer, but you can make whatever you want with the synthesizer. It’s also open source and free to use :)
This creates a very strong argument for not having a music editor as built-in functionality.
ah yeah, you know, in retrospect that makes a lot of sense, it's probably better if fans and devs can make their own stand alone synths rather than pre-boxing one in with the program itself, in pico8 it works because everything is supposed to be self contained, but not everyone will want to use the bosca synthesizer in their godot project, so it would just be extra bloat to the engine for people who want to make their own
Thank you for porting Bosca Ceoil to Godot!
You got featured on Games From Scratch!
Yeah, I quite noticed :) Thanks, Mike!
yeeeaaaah!!! :D
i love what you're doing here! however in linux i start off having a good experience until the music starts to get crunchy and my whole pc slows down to a near hault, and this is with only one pattern and no other programs running, thankyou for devoting time to this project btw:)
Oh, that’s unfortunate. Sounds like a problem with the synthesizer. I don’t have a Linux system, but I’ll try to investigate. Thanks for the report!
Hey again! I’ve got myself a Pop OS install on an old laptop, and after playing around for a bit I couldn’t reproduce any problem like you describe.
Would you mind giving me a bit more details? Namely, what’s your operating system and hardware spec? Were you doing anything specific in the moment it started to get crunchy? Any particular instrument, effect, filter and volume setting? Can you reproduce the issue or was it a one-time thing? Does it happen with different patterns after some time or is there anything that they have in common?
Details like that will give me a better starting point to keep looking, and maybe other users would then be able to confirm. If you have a GitHub account, I’d appreciate this info to be provided as a report there: https://github.com/YuriSizov/boscaceoil-blue/issues
This helps keeping track of every issue in one place. But also don’t feel like you have to do all this work. I’ll be testing it on Linux more now, and may end up repeating your experience at some point with my tools at the ready.
Thanks in advance, whatever you decide!